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I'm designing a switching mode power supply to supply 150V at 10mA to a nixie tube that is rated for 150V and 3.5mA. The circuit diagram will be very similar to this design, with the main difference that I'm powering a single tube instead of 6.

If I understand correctly, the resistor is needed to limit the current flow, so as not to blow the tube. The resistor would have to be 42K Ohms (V/I or 150/0.0035). However, only the output current of the resistor is used in that equation. There are 6.5mA of current at 150V unaccounted for. Are these 6.5mA of current "addressed"/used in the power dissipation calculation (P=V*I) as the remaining current is dissipated as heat in the resistor? Or does the power dissipation calculation still use the output current of the resistor?

If the latter, what happens to the 6.5mA of current not used by the load?

Translucent Dragon
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  • This looks like a horrible example you came up with, is there any actual problem you've come across which made you came up with this question/example? Also, that's not how power supplies work like, at all. – Harry Svensson Jul 19 '17 at 05:27
  • I do have a specific example, but it would likely make the question more confusing because I'm still very new at electronics. Would it still be worth putting all the specifics in, even if it seems like the question is jumbled? – Translucent Dragon Jul 19 '17 at 05:30
  • First of all, a power supply that says "150V 10mA" means that it will output a steady 150V as long as you don't ask for more than 10mA, if you use more than 10mA then the 150V would drop, because you're outside of the "guaranteed" range. So if your circuit only need 3.5mA, then the power supply would have no problem what so ever to deliver 150V and 3.5mA, because 3.5mA is less than 10mA. – Harry Svensson Jul 19 '17 at 05:34
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    As @HarrySvensson pointed out, the max current rating usually mentioned on power supplies is the maximum power rating that doesn't mean that they will supply that current all the time(Unless you have a Constant Current supply, which usually is not the case). – Mayank Jul 19 '17 at 05:37
  • And your calculation is also wrong if considering purely theoretical approach as well. The resistor will be in parallel to load and calculation will be like 150/6.5mA=23kohm. If you will use a resistor in series than voltage will be dropped and not the current. – Mayank Jul 19 '17 at 05:39
  • I think I have a misunderstanding of the circuit I'm altering. I'm going to further edit the question to clear it up. – Translucent Dragon Jul 19 '17 at 05:42
  • How about make a [schematic](http://www.falstad.com/circuit/circuitjs.html)? That way you can't fool anyone, not even yourself. – Harry Svensson Jul 19 '17 at 05:45
  • I'm not sure I can create a schematic, since I'm uncertain as to what happens to the energy that the switching mode power supply outputs that isn't used by the nixie tube (I thought it was dissipated by the resistor just above the tube in the above schematic), and I'd need to create a SMPS from scratch to test that. I'd prefer to understand how electricity moves through the system before I begin designing. – Translucent Dragon Jul 19 '17 at 05:53
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    You know, babies crawl before they walk, and then they walk before they run, and then they run before they bicycle. Right now, you're trying to bicycle without knowing how to walk. I strongly suggest that you start learning how to walk and run before you try to bicycle. In other words if my analogies are flying too high, get to know ohm's law and KCL and KVL. Watch 40 hours about it on youtube. Look at tests from schools regarding circuit theory. Because 150V is 150V, you could get a very nasty shock and possibly die from it if you're very unlucky. Just because you don't know how to walk&run. – Harry Svensson Jul 19 '17 at 06:03
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    Thank you for the help! I'm working through this system, even though its lightyears ahead of me, so that I can get a basic understanding of the principles of electronics while still working on something interest. I don't plan on testing it practically, or at least not until I KNOW what I'm doing. That being said, I think I will delete this post, as the question is based on misinformation that needs to be addressed from a more fundamental base. – Translucent Dragon Jul 19 '17 at 06:27
  • Please read [Choosing power supply, how to get the voltage and current ratings?](https://electronics.stackexchange.com/q/34745/6334) and then see if you still need an answer to this question. – The Photon Jul 19 '17 at 14:30

2 Answers2

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You don't seem to understand the operation of a nixie tube at all.

You need the datasheet for your Nixie, since you don't specify it, here's a typical one of the old stock available on Ebay ...Burroughs B-5859 page 1 and page 2.

The critical section from page 2 is shown here:

enter image description here

I've added lines for the current (3.4 mA) and the tube segment voltage when alight. You can see from the voltage on the Y axis the supplied voltage is always well above the tube sustaining voltage.
The way each number in the tube operates is that the voltage rises above what is called the strike voltage, and once conducting this voltage falls to the sustaining voltage.

In the schematic you provided, notice that the power supply voltage is in fact 180 V DC.
With the tube shown above if you had a 170 V DC power supply and 130 V sustaining voltage you would have an anode resistor of:

(170 - 130) / 0.0034 --> 11.7k Ohm

If the sustaining voltage was 145 V, then the anode resister would be:

(170 -145) / 0.0034 --> 7.3k Ohms

So in each case only a small portion of the power supply voltage is across the anode resistor, the majority of the voltage is the sustaining voltage across the tube element that is on.

The sustaining voltage for the Nixie tube varies from tube to tube and also varies depending on temperature and exposure to light. (A tube is harder to start in the dark)

Additional info
Since you've now pointed out the tube you are using (IN-8-2), here's some more points to think about.
The current rating to get all the digits to appear constant brightness means that for each digit you need separate current control. If you don't do this then digits such as "1" appear very bright while an "8" appears much dimmer.
It's also a challenge when using digits and the decimal dot, since if this tube is not multiplexed, you have to design to ensure both the digit and dot can run together (you can do this by having a negative supply for the dot).

Since you typically only have a single anode resistor this means that you need to add separate resisters to the cathode pins to control the current individually.

Let's try an example, though I don't know the absolute currents required for each digit, so will propose guess values using the datasheet data.

From the datasheet: enter image description here

enter image description here

  1. We know the worst case firing voltage is 170 V, so lets set the PS at 180 V DC. The datasheet tells us not to go above 200 V DC.
  2. We know the lowest sustaining voltage is 100 V DC.
  3. The maximum current we'll set at 3.5 mA for the "8" digit"
  4. Lets assume the "1" digit will half of the "8", so about 1.75 mA.

Let's assume also that the anode resistor is all that's needed for the "8" digit, we won't use a cathode resistor.

The anode resistor is then:

(180 - 100) / 0.0035 --> 23k Ohms with no cathode resistance required.
When the "8" cathode is pulled to ground, the voltage will be above the strike voltage. Once the digit is on the anode will be at 100 V DC (worst case), so there will be 80 V across the anode resistor (0.28 W, so I'd fit a 1/2 W resistor). If the sustaining voltage is higher for the tubes, say 130 V then you may have to recalculate the anode resistor, since this would drop the digit current.

For the "1" digit the resistance needed is:

(180 - 100) / 0.00175 --> 45k Ohms. Since we have 23k already in the anode the cathode resistor needs to be (45 - 23) --> 22k Ohms. When the "1" low side resistor is pulled to ground you'll have about 40 V across the cathode resistor and 40 V across the anode resistor.

Having built a bunch of clocks (though they were all multiplexed) based on Nixies in my misspent youth, my opinion is that it's best to use a constant current low side driver with one anode resistor setting the maximum safe current. It's then easy to use a 4 bit D/A to set the current values for each digit/dot as you multiplex through them, especially it the clock is MCU based.

Jack Creasey
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  • The tube I'm using is an [IN8-2](http://www.tube-tester.com/sites/nixie/dat_arch/IN-8_IN-8-2.pdf), which has a firing voltage of 170V and sustaining voltage of 100V. But I don't understand why you used the (firing - sustaining) voltage as the voltage portion in Ohm's Law. – Translucent Dragon Jul 20 '17 at 04:54
  • I did not use (firing - sustaining) ...I used 170 V (which would be the PS voltage) minus the sustaining voltage for the tube I used as an example. You'll notice it's also the lowest curve used in the example in the datasheet. ...You said you power supply was only going to be 150 V ....I was trying to help you understand that that voltage will not work for your tube. Now you've added the datasheet for your tube it highlights several more problems you will have, but you need a PS voltage of more than 170 V DC (perhaps 180 -190 V DC) to ensure the tube will start under all conditions. – Jack Creasey Jul 20 '17 at 05:47
  • I misunderstood a lot about how these tubes worked. Is this correct: for an IN-8-2, the max voltage without damage to the tube is 200V. The maximum voltage necessary to get the tube to actually light (the firing voltage) is 170V. Once lit, the tube operates with less of a voltage drop (the sustaining voltage) at a minimum of 100V. || Additionally, I don't understand why the datasheet states that the anode current can't exceed 2.5mA when it also says the working current is 2.5-4.5mA. If you have a working current of 4.5mA, aren't you exceeding the 2.5mA limit? – Translucent Dragon Jul 22 '17 at 23:42
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The resistor would have to be 42K Ohms (V/I or 150/0.0035)

This isn't correct, yes that is Ohm's law but in this case we have to use it in a different way.

Let's take an example of just a simple LED and a resistor. We know that in a series circuit the current flowing through all components is the same but the voltage drop across each component can be different.

If we want to supply an LED with 3.5mA then that must mean that the resistor also has 3.5mA flowing through it. By simply doing \$R = V_{supply}/I\$ you aren't taking any of the component voltage drops into account.

enter image description here

If we take this example circuit, we can see that the voltage drop across the LED is 2.2V, this is known as the 'forward voltage' which can be found in the datasheet of any LED (this is the same as your 'sustaining voltage' for your nixie tubes).

We have our supply voltage of 5V and the voltage drop across the LED as 2.2V, therefore the voltage drop across the resistor must be 2.8V (\$V_{R1} = V_{supply} - V_{F}\$)

Going back to the earlier point that the current flowing through all components is the same we can now calculate the current flowing through the resistor at a given resistance now that we know the voltage drop across it by using Ohms law.
We said at the start that we want to supply the LED with 3.5mA so our resistance needs to be \$800\Omega\$ (\$R_{1} = V_{R1} / I\$ or \$R_{1} = 2.8 / 0.0035\$)

If we had simply used \$R = V_{supply}/I\$ we would have gotten a resistance of \$1428\Omega\$. Now, if we had used this resistor value, then the actual current flowing in the circuit would have only been \$1.9mA\$ (\$I = V_{R1} / R\$) as the voltage drop across our resistor would have still been 2.8V.

As a final note to remember, you can only use \$R = V_{supply}/I\$ accurately in a purely resistive circuit